ive started a discussion on accessifyforum about how i think that accessible
websites are at a disadvantage because they practice honesty in a dishonest
industry (seo) and that many small websites wish small budgets created
without the use of a copywriter from content supplied by a client need
'black hat' techniques to get a decent position...

anyone want to comment on this?

Mark

mark | r wrote:

> ive started a discussion on accessifyforum about how i think that
> accessible
> websites are at a disadvantage because they practice honesty in a
> dishonest
> industry (seo) and that many small websites wish small budgets created
> without the use of a copywriter from content supplied by a client need
> 'black hat' techniques to get a decent position...

> anyone want to comment on this?

> Mark

How in the world ACCESSIBLE websites (to visitors and, therefore search
engines? or you use this word in some other sense?) can be at disadvantage?


Sincerely,
Dmitri
http://www.1-script.com/install/
Check out my CGI scripts installation offer
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On Tue, 10 May 2005 14:06:01 +0100, "mark | r" <markrush@gmail.com>
wrote:

>ive started a discussion on accessifyforum about how i think that accessible
>websites are at a disadvantage because they practice honesty in a dishonest
>industry (seo) and that many small websites wish small budgets created
>without the use of a copywriter from content supplied by a client need
>'black hat' techniques to get a decent position...

By and large unless it's a niche industry small sites won't do much.
If it's a choice of go black hat or hire a copy-writer, hire a
copywriter. Same price but more effective. Hiring a copywriter should
really be in your price for the job if it comes to it.

BB


--
www.kruse.co.uk/ seo@kruse.demon.co.uk
seo that watches the river flow...
--

"Big Bill" <kruse@cityscape.co.uk> wrote in message
news:78n181h26b28ngn0q4u3th4g1jcal9krm3@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 10 May 2005 14:06:01 +0100, "mark | r" <markrush@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> >ive started a discussion on accessifyforum about how i think that
accessible
> >websites are at a disadvantage because they practice honesty in a
dishonest
> >industry (seo) and that many small websites wish small budgets created
> >without the use of a copywriter from content supplied by a client need
> >'black hat' techniques to get a decent position...
>
> By and large unless it's a niche industry small sites won't do much.
> If it's a choice of go black hat or hire a copy-writer, hire a
> copywriter. Same price but more effective. Hiring a copywriter should
> really be in your price for the job if it comes to it.

i know - just aranged first meetings with a local copywriter - i guess ill
have to take my business to another level

Mark

"www.1-script.com" <info_at_1-script_dot_com@foo.com> wrote in message
news:u84ge.30990$8b3.24084@fe06.news.easynews.com. ..
> mark | r wrote:
>
> > ive started a discussion on accessifyforum about how i think that
> > accessible
> > websites are at a disadvantage because they practice honesty in a
> > dishonest
> > industry (seo) and that many small websites wish small budgets created
> > without the use of a copywriter from content supplied by a client need
> > 'black hat' techniques to get a decent position...
>
> > anyone want to comment on this?
>
> > Mark
>
> How in the world ACCESSIBLE websites (to visitors and, therefore search
> engines? or you use this word in some other sense?) can be at
disadvantage?

because a page titled "fred jones and sons widget manufacturers" is going to
go nowhere fast on the search engines when it should say "widgets widget
manufacturers widget sales - fred jones" - accessible design states that
page titles have to be TITLES not keywords!

ok you can work around it but then its not accessible any more is it?

Mark

On Tue, 10 May 2005 17:37:35 +0100, mark | r <markrush@gmail.com> wrote:
> "www.1-script.com" <info_at_1-script_dot_com@foo.com> wrote in message
> news:u84ge.30990$8b3.24084@fe06.news.easynews.com. ..
>> mark | r wrote:
>>
>>> ive started a discussion on accessifyforum about how i think that
>>> accessible websites are at a disadvantage because they practice
>>> honesty in a
>>> dishonest industry (seo) and that many small websites wish small
>>> budgets created
>>> without the use of a copywriter from content supplied by a client need
>>> 'black hat' techniques to get a decent position...
>>
>>> anyone want to comment on this?
>>>
>> How in the world ACCESSIBLE websites (to visitors and, therefore search
>> engines? or you use this word in some other sense?) can be at
>> disadvantage?
>
> because a page titled "fred jones and sons widget manufacturers" is going
> to go nowhere fast on the search engines when it should say "widgets
> widget
> manufacturers widget sales - fred jones" - accessible design states that
> page titles have to be TITLES not keywords!
>

If the page concerned is actually accessible and part of an accessible and
usable site, the 'Fred Jones and sons widget manufecturers' as a title
will do just fine for the homepage or index of the site. As long as the
other pages have to the point titles, the index page is not very
interesting anyway.

> ok you can work around it but then its not accessible any more is it?
>

How so?


--
,-- --<--@ -- PretLetters: 'woest wyf', met vele interesses: ----------.
| weblog | http://home.wanadoo.nl/b.de.zoete/_private/weblog.html |
| webontwerp | http://home.wanadoo.nl/b.de.zoete/html/webontwerp.html |
|zweefvliegen | http://home.wanadoo.nl/b.de.zoete/html/vliegen.html |
`-------------------------------------------------- --<--@ ------------'

mark | r wrote:

>
> "www.1-script.com" <info_at_1-script_dot_com@foo.com> wrote in message
> news:u84ge.30990$8b3.24084@fe06.news.easynews.com. ..
>> mark | r wrote:
>>
>> > ive started a discussion on accessifyforum about how i think that
>> > accessible
>> > websites are at a disadvantage because they practice honesty in a
>> > dishonest
>> > industry (seo) and that many small websites wish small budgets
>> > created without the use of a copywriter from content supplied by a
>> > client need 'black hat' techniques to get a decent position...
>>
>> > anyone want to comment on this?
>>
>> > Mark
>>
>> How in the world ACCESSIBLE websites (to visitors and, therefore
>> search engines? or you use this word in some other sense?) can be at
> disadvantage?
>
> because a page titled "fred jones and sons widget manufacturers" is
> going to go nowhere fast on the search engines when it should say
> "widgets widget manufacturers widget sales - fred jones" - accessible
> design states that page titles have to be TITLES not keywords!

You stuff too many keywords :-)

Widget manufacturer Fred Jones (but I doubt if you should put)

About widget manufacturing
Questions about Widgets
Widget price list

etc.


--
John Perl SEO tools: http://johnbokma.com/perl/
Experienced (web) developer: http://castleamber.com/
Get a SEO report of your site for just 100 USD:
http://johnbokma.com/websitedesign/seo-expert-help.html

Barbara de Zoete wrote:

> On Tue, 10 May 2005 17:37:35 +0100, mark | r <markrush@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>> "www.1-script.com" <info_at_1-script_dot_com@foo.com> wrote in
>> message news:u84ge.30990$8b3.24084@fe06.news.easynews.com. ..
>>> mark | r wrote:
>>>
>>>> ive started a discussion on accessifyforum about how i think that
>>>> accessible websites are at a disadvantage because they practice
>>>> honesty in a
>>>> dishonest industry (seo) and that many small websites wish small
>>>> budgets created
>>>> without the use of a copywriter from content supplied by a client
>>>> need 'black hat' techniques to get a decent position...
>>>
>>>> anyone want to comment on this?
>>>>
>>> How in the world ACCESSIBLE websites (to visitors and, therefore
>>> search engines? or you use this word in some other sense?) can be at
>>> disadvantage?
>>
>> because a page titled "fred jones and sons widget manufacturers" is
>> going to go nowhere fast on the search engines when it should say
>> "widgets widget
>> manufacturers widget sales - fred jones" - accessible design states
>> that page titles have to be TITLES not keywords!
>>
>
> If the page concerned is actually accessible and part of an accessible
> and usable site, the 'Fred Jones and sons widget manufecturers' as a
> title will do just fine for the homepage or index of the site. As
> long as the other pages have to the point titles, the index page is
> not very interesting anyway.
>
>> ok you can work around it but then its not accessible any more is it?
>
> How so?

Widget widgets buy widgets wigdets

And with content like:

widget ............ widget ............. widget ........... widget
widget ............ widget ............. widget ........... widget
widget ............ widget ............. widget ........... widget
widget ............ widget ............. widget ........... widget
widget ............ widget ............. widget ........... widget
widget ............ widget ............. widget ........... widget

:-D.


--
John Perl SEO tools: http://johnbokma.com/perl/
Experienced (web) developer: http://castleamber.com/
Get a SEO report of your site for just 100 USD:
http://johnbokma.com/websitedesign/seo-expert-help.html

John Bokma wrote:

> Widget manufacturer Fred Jones (but I doubt if you should put)

Fred Jones there, and I would do it only once, *unless* Fred Jones is well
known :-)


--
John Perl SEO tools: http://johnbokma.com/perl/
Experienced (web) developer: http://castleamber.com/
Get a SEO report of your site for just 100 USD:
http://johnbokma.com/websitedesign/seo-expert-help.html

"mark | r" <markrush@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:4280b99b$0$329$cc9e4d1f@news.dial.pipex.com.. .
> ive started a discussion on accessifyforum about how i think that
> accessible
> websites are at a disadvantage because they practice honesty in a
> dishonest
> industry (seo) and that many small websites wish small budgets created
> without the use of a copywriter from content supplied by a client need
> 'black hat' techniques to get a decent position...
>
> anyone want to comment on this?
>
> Mark
>
>

I have numerous pages that are AAA compliant and
rank high for the target phrases.
Getting in to a habit of creating accessible pages is a
good thing to do and makes building new optimised pages
so much easier.